Michaela:
Couple of episodes in and you totally get it. The But Why series asking all sorts of questions. These dialogues are going to get more raw, more real, and I am so grateful. You're here. If you liked this podcast, click subscribe hit, like send me a message. I welcome questions, comments and gripes and complaints. Also check out my awesome books on Amazon. Okay, here we go. Next episode of the why series, because we can start over. Good morning, Carl. How are you today? I'm great. How are you? I'm good. I actually I'm in the epicenter of the smoke of the California wildfires. Um, so I went for a walk yesterday, bad idea. And this morning I'm like, Oh, so choked up. Like I have a cough. People are gonna think I've got COVID.
Karl:
Oh, that stinks. How far is it from you?
Michaela:
Um, well there's so many burning all around us. I think there's like 338, um, in California right now, but there's three big ones and, uh, they've almost got the one out that was, uh, about 15 miles from us that one's almost out. So, but we had one that was just a few miles the other night, and then they, they got that one out really quick. They had massive air tanker support on it. So it was like kind of like the apocalypse with the big tanker zoom in really low and stuff. I mean, it was wild, you know, and it was broad daylight, but it was really dark. It's a super eerie, super eerie feeling. We're used to it now, you know, um, in California we've been dealing with this for, Oh gosh, quite a few years. I mean, we had a really big one, the King fire in 2014 or 2016, it was 2016. I think I need to look that up. And, uh, it was 130,000 acres right. In our backyard. So we're pretty used to it at this point. Yeah. Um, but you and I are going to talk all things gratitude today, which is such a fabulous topic and such apropos timing. Um, and I'd love for you to share with the listeners a little bit about you and what you do and what you've got going on.
Karl:
Okay. That sounds good. Yeah. I have a working, been working with a new method with my clients called dig to fly and it really,
Karl:
I think, I think you could really help your listeners. So I'm excited to kind of, I don't think I've, I've talked about it on one other podcast, so, Oh my gosh. Well, golly. Yeah.
Michaela:
Well, very excited about that. Um, and you're going to be, you're going to be kind of in the midst of coming off the heels of what was the, but why series asking lots of questions, um, and kind of having these raw and real conversations. And so the tone of this recording is going to be that it's, it's, it's going to be some really like honest, um, questions that, that have honestly been asked to trigger people. I want to get people outside of their comfort zone right now, because I really am in this space where I believe that people need to adapt or die like adapter don't. This is the new world, and we've got to embrace it and start and, and move out of our victimhood. And our woe is me and move into the reality of what life is going to look like. And those of us that can configure this out that can tap into gratitude that can find our voice of courage that can do these things are going to rise. And those of us that aren't are going to be struck with all sorts of mental illness, physical ailments, et cetera. Now's the time. So this is, this is great, great conversation. Um, I love a couple of the things that I had done some research about from your website. And I really want to talk about it. Can we start off by talking about the science of gratitude? I know you share a little of that on your website.
Karl:
Yeah, sure. Oh, there's lots of great stuff. Oh yeah, that sounds good. Okay.
Michaela:
Okay. Why don't you share with me, help me understand the science of gratitude, help the listeners understand. Um, it, you know, my backstory is I'm a psychotherapist. I think I had an entire class on this, but
Karl:
Are we, are we recording now? Cause I was like, I don't know. Okay.
Michaela:
Yeah. We've been recording the whole time.
Karl:
Revet blip in the, in the beginning. Um,
Michaela:
Well wipe that out.
Karl:
Okay. So, uh, yes, the science of gratitude, there's so many facets to it. Um, what the core of it comes down to, uh, what I found is it's the chemicals in our brain. So there's a dopamine and serotonin. Those are chemicals. We both need to stay in balance. Dopamine is the get up and go drug and serotonin is the I'm. Okay. Everything's cool chill drug that is released, uh, by different experiences and different thoughts and feelings. So the more we can understand how to utilize these, uh, the more likely we can balance out our days and, um, be more productive and happier in the process. So what's really cool. Um, science has not figured out a drug how to release dopamine and serotonin, um, together.
Michaela:
Thank God. I think we should stop all that noise about manipulating our natural bodies. I think that that's causing us a lot of woes right now. Yes. And so we have to figure out how to do it right as humans.
Karl:
Exactly. And that's where gratitude plays a huge role now. Um, there's, it's important. You know, we talked, you talked about questions right at the beginning of like getting to the heart of things. And I think, um, that's one thing and we can talk about that a little bit. Um, but uh, before I get too far ahead of myself, the science of gratitude, um, releases these chemicals, dopamine, and serotonin, and allows you to balance yourself out, but it's using gratitude to help you do that. And that's, what's cool about gratitude. It can actually do both. So depending on how you use gratitude. So if you're like, Oh, I'm grateful for this moment, this interview, that's that serotonin. That's like, everything's okay. This is a good spot. I'm happy. I'm safe. I'm healthy. Yeah. Let's, let's keep this going. Now you can mostly be grateful for things that you are able to do, actions that you're able to do.
Karl:
And that really helps release the dopamine. So I'm grateful that I can write a blog post. So let's say after this interview, I'm going to write an article and I'm going to post it tomorrow. And then, you know, so I'm thinking of the steps. I'm like, okay, first thing I want to do is I want to write about, you know, um, you know, the deep questions that really help get to the heart of an issue, right? So now, you know, that can be my, the seed that I plant and the thing that, you know, you can start to go down the path of like, Oh man, like, what do I say about this subject? Oh, everything's already been said about now, you're, you're creating those that anxiety. And you're reducing that dopamine. So it's really where you put your thoughts. And Viktor Frankl said, you know, basically, you know, the thought there's a there, you know, right. When that thought happens, there's this pause before you allow the stimulus to take over those feelings to take over, right? So you have this moment where you can go down and you know, many different pathways and it's up to you to really pick the pathway that is best for you and helps you, um, you know, achieve what you're trying to achieve. And maybe it's just being relaxed and saying, it's okay to sit on my couch and read a book and not go wash my dishes like that.
Michaela:
I said, me never. I need to learn that one. Aye. That's silly that literally exactly what you just said is like the bane of my existence. Like I am such a busy body and I love, love, love to read. I'm a writer, obviously. So I feel like being a reader makes me a better writer. And so it's one of the most important things to me. And yet I cannot sit if I've got things in my immediate space that need to be put together, cleaned up whatever. Oh, that's a tough one for me. So I love that you used that example. I was thinking about this as you were talking. So yesterday they did some plumbing work on my pipes and uh, for the entire evening. And I'm, I actually have not even had a drink of water yet today, which is not good, but, um, my water tasted like crap, like, like, uh, pipe glue and dirt and all of that.
Michaela:
And so I was thinking, um, of a gratitude statement, right? As you were talking to him, I'm like, if I have this glass of water, I'm just kind of pondering this and I, and I drink it and I say, I'm grateful for this glass of water. Am I grateful? Is that the action? So I'm grateful to be able to drink the water or I'm grateful that I live in a place that has clear and fresh water. Cause that's kind of both, right? That's the serotonin and the dopamine means you have to make that distinct distinction.
Karl:
No. And they cross, they cross paths. Right. So the idea is, you know, kind of future versus present. Um, and the, so if you're like, I'm grateful for this glass of water, you're, you're basically saying this is okay. Like this is a good thing this moment. Yeah.
Michaela:
But if I say I'm grateful for fresh water, that's just like this generalized dopamine floods.
Karl:
It could be. Yeah. So that's yeah. Or I'm grateful that I can get up off the couch and go get that glass of water. Then it's a little bit more dopamine because you, if you just say I'm grateful for you might be thirsty and that grateful thought, well, will Sage satiate you and not get you to go up off that couch. But if you're thinking, Oh, I'm grateful to be able to stand up, walk into the kitchen and pour myself a glass of water. You are forward thinking and appreciating what these actions can do for you. And that's more of the dopamine release.
Michaela:
Okay. So let's switch to another topic on your website. Cause it perfectly ties in at the moment, which is getting rid of negative emotions. Because as I am sitting, sitting here, coughing, choking on this smoke that I breathed in yesterday, while hiking, I want to go get a glass of water, but I'm thinking it's going to taste like crap. It's going to taste like dirt. It's not going to satiate me. I'm going to be angry. Like go have all these negative emotions, I'm drinking coffee. Um, and that's not good. I really shouldn't be having a glass of water, but I don't want to cause my negative emotions are preventing me from doing so. So let's talk about getting rid of negative emotions.
Karl:
Okay. One thing we now getting rid of them, but accepting and appreciating these negative things.
Michaela:
Good. I liked that. I liked the shift in narrative. I like that
Karl:
What they are. Right. So it's nothing wrong. Anger is a good thing. Um, when done well, that's like anything, happiness is a good thing when done well, when people are like, I'm so happy, I'm going to jump off this stage and style, you know, and, and, uh, crowds a surf. Well, there's three people in the crowd, not a good choice, right? Like you're making a choice from happiness cause you're just like, yeah. But the problem is you're going to land face first, break your nose and you're going to have a bad rest of your concert experience. So the idea is okay, that between stimulus and response, what is that what's happening and what are you choosing to focus on? And this takes a lot. I don't do you meditate every day. Okay, good. So meditation is a great practice. So is journaling. Um, so is, uh, conversations with therapist, friends and talking through a lot of these. So there's a lot of ways to get through it. Um, I meditate. I journal, I do all three, uh, and therapists are wonderful to for this too, cause it really kinda kind of helps ground you and, and um, uh, but sometimes, you know, if you don't have the money or, you know, some people are afraid of therapists, uh, friends work well to a really well-grounded friends. So know the difference between friends that are good at this and not right. So
Michaela:
Well as a therapist with a podcast, I'm really trying to abolish that whole fear of therapist thing.
Karl:
That's true. So if, if you, as a therapist are working with somebody and you, you know, it's up to them to kind of process and work through this. And I think this is where I think a therapist really works well. Cause that's what they're trained to do and friends aren't. So it's really being able to, you know, understand who's your audience and how to have a really, you know, work through things through yourself. Now
Michaela:
Let's pause on that for a second. Cause I get this question a lot as a psychotherapist, people will ask, how do you either a not get attached to your client? Like how do you not bring that stuff? Home is what they'll say or they'll say, Hmm, how is talking to a therapist different than just talking to a friend? And there's a huge distinction. One. Um, I been trained how to do no harm, how to meet people where they're at when silence is golden, when to ask a question, um, and then I've had thousands of hours of training and experience working with people to hone those skills and to pick up on nonverbal cues and to watch people as they're going through their process and hold back or insert or assist. Um, and also at the end of the day, like I not attached to their outcomes.
Michaela:
I want globally what is best for them. But at the end of the day, I'm not in their relationships with them. So I can talk about their relationships without attachment, which is the difference. Right? I can talk about the things happening in their life, to them, with their boss, whatever, without that attachment, where friends, as much as they can try, they can't always do that. They can't always detach because they bring their narrative to your, they know your life, they know your experiences. Um, you know, you have that friend that's just constantly switching jobs and griping about their boss and you, and you're like, well, you know, I've, I've heard this for years. Maybe it's you, not your boss.
Karl:
Yeah, exactly. Yeah.
Michaela:
And the therapist can ask the kinds of questions that detaches from that, that reality so that, you know, you're not putting that kind of wedge in your relationship. And then the other thing is when people ask me, how do you not bring it home? The true answer is I don't always not bring it home. Sometimes I have a client with a very tragic story or a client that I've had for a long time that, um, has a death in the family or something like that or a great loss. And, and I do feel that however, I've been trained how to compartmentalize those emotions and how to meditate, journal, talk to my therapist and be mindful so that I can let go of those things. It's not that I'm perfect at, not at leaving it at the, at the office. It's that I've been trained on how to let it go after all those things you were talking about.
Karl:
Yes. Yeah. I'm glad you brought that up. Yeah, that's a great point. Okay. So
Michaela:
Where are we after that tangent?
Karl:
So, uh, I think, uh, you, what's really one of the key parts of really being able to tap into these, uh, these things with, you know, like I have this fear of drinking my water, you know, you know, but I need to drink water. So that coming back to the emotions, like it's okay to be a little angry, but what's not okay. Is the feed that beast and allow it to rage until you start throwing dishes across the room and smashing them into your sink. Um, and that's where, you know, kind of taking that pause and saying, okay, like, yeah, I'm a little angry and acknowledging those feelings, appreciating those feelings, being grateful because one day this is all going to end it. We're not going to feel these things the way that we do, whether you believe in heaven, whether you believe in God or, you know, greater universe or are a connected universe or whatever's out there, right.
Karl:
Um, it's going to change and it's going to change significantly. And you're going to, you know, as you get older, I've noticed I'm 44 now. Um, little things that I never used to appreciate, I appreciate so much more now because I'm like, Oh yeah, like going for a jog at 44 is completely different than going for a jog at 24, you know, 20 years makes a huge difference and you start to realize like, wow, like I can't run forever. I, you know, I have to take breaks. Um, and so I think it's important to acknowledge his feelings and say, okay, I do appreciate that this current situation I'm alive. I have the ability to, uh, go drink water from the faucet if I want to, if I'm really needing a drink, but do I have other options and do I want to choose those other options?
Karl:
And I think it's, you know, come back to mindfulness, it's being a watcher of these thoughts and noticing them and seeing, wow, like that was cool. Like I'd never even realized that I wanted Gatorade in this moment. I'm like, Oh wow. Like it's been two years since I've had some Gatorade, like, you know what, I'm going to go down to the corner store and buy some Gatorade because that's going to hit the spot and that's going to help me make sure I stay hydrated. And so, and that's being grateful for these options. And I think that's really important, you know, and, and being aware of these thoughts and these emotions and, you know, being able to choose which direction we want to take them in.
Michaela:
That all makes perfect sense. And now I'm taking them and they need to go get some Gatorade. I don't have to deal with the potential let down of my water. Um, and you know, I just turn on the faucet and let it run if it weren't for the fact that there's like, you know, 338 wildfires where everything are state and I don't want to waste water, but maybe the showers this morning did it. Um, so I could add there, there we go. That's, that's what I'm going to go with. So the showers drained out enough water. Um, okay. So this is a big one for me. And it's something I've kind of always, uh, you know, I guess I got this from my parents is I don't do well with complainer's. Um, as the therapist, this has been one of my greatest things that I've had to work on is really accepting and meeting people where they're at and knowing that this is their perspective, this is their reality and not inserting my own kind of prejudice and beliefs, but I have a really hard time with people who are constantly glass, half empty.
Michaela:
She's like, I, and I used to try to be like, well, what about this? But what about that? But what about this? And then I realized that complainer's can continue the complaining endlessly. Like they will always have a counter to anything positive because they, like, it seems like they like to complain. And granted, I like to complain too. Like I have moments where I get super irritated with our internet and complain and bitch and gripe, and that it's loading and I can't upload, but I also recognize like how to get out of that cycle. Can you talk a little about complainer's and that behavior?
Karl:
Yeah. Yeah. This is a great cause. Right. When at the beginning I was talking about, um, my, uh, dig, the fly method that I've been using with my clients and
Michaela:
Like sore message you talk about too.
Karl:
This is, uh, basically a, a five sequence, uh, question. So that I think really that's like you say, you're trained to ask questions. Um, and when to pause, when not to, when to ask certain questions, when not to, I think the sequence of questions are really important and that's kind of where this came from. As I've been, you know, working on myself, working with clients, I was like, okay, like, what is what's, what is the best way to kind of go through this? So can we, would you like to try it? Like, let's talk about a struggle with somebody that you're having and then I'll go through it. Do you want to try it?
Michaela:
Oh my gosh. We're going to do my real life. Yeah. Okay. Okay. Let's do it. Let's do it. I'm ready. I'm emotionally ready. I'm grounded. I'm putting my feet on the floor. I'm ready. Yeah.
Karl:
So what struggle are you currently having? Like, do you have somebody that's a complainer in your life? Do you, uh, it can be something else that it, this is what spurred it and I'm like, okay, let's make sure it's true to you before. I don't want you to make up a fake person, but something that,
Michaela:
Oh my gosh, the thing that I'm having such a hard time within my life is such a big political topic right now, though, as scares me to talk about it on a podcast with like 50,000 weekly listeners. Um, okay. So here is my struggle. Okay. I am having a hard time with people in my life who, uh, are in support of things that I see to be, uh, rooted in violence and hate. Uh, and when I want to talk with them about these things, I am told that I am not in a place to be able to receive it, which feels very dismissive and feels like they want to continue their victimhood by not having a dialogue. That's my, that's my biggest struggle right now.
Karl:
I love it. I love how you, you phrased it too. Like you're not attacking anybody, but good. Okay. How tough is this struggle on a scale of zero to 10, zero being easy, 10 being unbearable?
Michaela:
Well, seeing as how yesterday, I got an email from a friend of 20 years who I've known since college, I worked with at a radio station in the Bay area. Uh, he literally sent me an email that said have a nice life. Um, that was the fun. I mean, it was, there was other things on it, but that was the lesson is, I would say, this is dang near a 10 for me right now. Like it is feeling so heavy. I have, I have another friend, a long, long time friend from San Diego, uh, who also made a similar kind of phrase to me. And it's just mind blowing because these people have known me for so long. They know where my heart is at. They know the history of the kinds of people that I welcome without judgment into my life and who I have as friends. So it's, it's, it's like bordering a 10 for me. It's that intense,
Karl:
Like 9.5 right around there. Okay. Okay. That's good. Now it's so if it's a 10, I, lot of times they say, okay, maybe we're not ready for this because there's no wiggle room once there's a 10. It's like, there's nothing you can do. But if, as long as it's under a 10 and 9.2 means that means you're not fully like all in on, like nothing's going to change. Okay.
Michaela:
I'm taking a deep breath for this. All right.
Karl:
So 9.2. Why do you, why do you,
Michaela:
Because it's, it saddens my heart greatly and it makes it, and it makes me question the noble truths. I know to be my truth about myself.
Karl:
Okay. So why, why does it, why does it really feel this intense to you? So is that, is it something, because
Michaela:
I think it feels this intense because one, it has me questioning my own integrity, which you know, is part of my noble truths. And it has me questioning how these people that were my friends that I loved for so long could behave like this. Like what is going on within them that is so heavy that they would do this.
Karl:
Mm, okay. So what are your expectations of them?
Michaela:
I mean, okay. Brain bubble out loud that they would wake the fuck up. Okay. Let me put back on my therapist, PC hat for a second. My people pleasing hat, um, that like, ultimately at the end of the day, that we could find a way to coexist, uh, with the pain, knowledge, and life experiences that we've had and still have a friendship.
Karl:
Okay. So how do you think they're feeling?
Michaela:
I've been asking myself that a lot lately probably angry at something much bigger than me. And I probably feel like an open, easy target because in their heart, they probably know that I'm not. And that, or they're angry at me for having a different viewpoint on something that they feel so strongly about. I don't know. They won't have a conversation.
Karl:
They won't talk to me. And why, why don't they want to talk with you?
Michaela:
Um, because they believe from the tone of certain things that I've shared on social media, uh, outright diddly, discrediting organizations that are rooted in violence and hate, uh, that I'm not in a space to be able to listen to them that I am the exact thing that they're trying to fight.
Karl:
Hm. This is good. This is really good. Okay. So what are a few small things you can appreciate about the situation
Michaela:
That in the greatest times of uncomfortability comes the best change?
Karl:
Hmm. How so?
Michaela:
Because it's not until we're truly uncomfortable with something that our old reptilian limbic brain kicks in and starts to solve the problem.
Karl:
Good. Okay. So what opportunities could come out of it?
Michaela:
I may lose those friendships, but I will probably show up differently moving forward in other friendships.
Karl:
Ah, nice. And how,
Michaela:
Uh, I think I'll be more mindful of, um, being my self, um, and knowing that as long as I speak my truth with grace, that I'm, I'm doing no harm.
Karl:
That's great. How do you feel now?
Michaela:
A lot better. Like, I'm like a lot better. We're really good.
Karl:
That's the dig? The fly method. Yeah.
Michaela:
Super good. Oh my gosh. I love that.
Karl:
So it's really important to dig in and, and understand what's going on inside. And because within every situation, it's our, it's our thoughts and emotions that are, you know, either pushing us forward or holding us back. And we, when we tune into them, when you say, let go of these friendships, you know, instead of fighting and clawing and hoping these things, you know, like you could be helping other people. And it's so tough to let friendships go and, you know, and make new ones be. But when we do, we're being more truthful and honest with who we are and what our truth is in the universe.
Michaela:
Wow. That is super, super, incredibly good. I love it. I absolutely love it.
Karl:
Cool. Okay.
Michaela:
I didn't expect a conversation on gratitude to go like this, but I've learned not to have any expectations of anything anymore. So this is good.
Karl:
Yeah.
Michaela:
Wow. Carl, that is incredible. So talk to me about how, how are you using this in your, in your life and how can people like find out about this and step? What, how do they get involved?
Karl:
So, uh, yeah, I'm actually in the middle of a rebrand going from bring gratitude to dig the fly.com. So dig the fly's not up. I should be ready hopefully by like mid October, I don't know when this is going to go live.
Michaela:
It was going to go, uh, in three weeks. But I think I might've just bumped you to Wednesday, Um, because it's such, it's the timing of it is just so needed right now.
Karl:
That's great. So then right now they go and go to bring gratitude.com. Eventually we'll be dig the fly.com. And the idea is really what I want people to do is kind of understand how each question builds on the next and, and helps you just, you know, really kind of dig in. And this is where I think, you know, that, ah, yes, I feel better. It's, it's where we start flying. Again. We feel weighted down by our thoughts and emotions. We feel uplifted by them. And I think that's the key, right? Like why do we take action on things? We feel uplifted by these things. And we, we can't wait to write that blog post. We can't wait to interview that person or a reply to a friend on Facebook. And I think you're kind of coming back to, you know, the friends you have difficulty with.
Karl:
I bet you, you have a hundred more friends that are in agreement with you and are ready to, you know, lift up our community versus try to drag it down. And I think that's the key part with friendships is connecting on a, in a positive way. Cause if we, if we start connecting, let's say you had these conversation with these friends. They're not budging, you're not budging. And most likely it's going to end bad. But if you have a conversation with somebody about some positive stuff in ways to improve, you know, our society community, and maybe create a Facebook group around it, or, you know, talk to your clients about, you know, these, you know, different things that you know that, uh, well, maybe you don't want to talk to your clients about it cause it's about them, but your community about it. And then it, then all tides kind of rise all boats. And eventually the people who aren't on board either they get on board or they kind of go off in another direction.
Michaela:
Uh, so true. And as you were talking, I was thinking about how I reached out to one. I first of course, ran to the bedroom when I got the email and started about back at my husband about what happened. And he's just like, well, okay. Um, but then I texted, he's like, you might need to take this to your girlfriends. So anyway, I texted, you know, my, my sisters in laws and my friends and a couple of people and they, they replied back with, then this isn't a friendship that's meant to be in your life right now. And I was like, no, that's not an answer. I'm still, no, I'm not okay with all of this. But when we just went through the process over the phone, over this podcast here now I actually, I actually feel better about it. I actually do agree with what they said.
Michaela:
I mean, you know, I had some like what an asshole replies, but then I also had some like, well, he's just, you know, he's just not a friend that's supposed to be in your life. Right. You know, like that kind of stuff. And so, but, but you know, I only felt validated by the ones that were like, yeah, what an asshole. I didn't feel validated by the idea of losing the friendship. But now that I've, that I've gone through dig to fly questions. I actually feel validated by the idea that I can let that friendship go. It's like, boom. Yeah, no, that was really good. And I can imagine there are a lot of people, uh, in their lives right now that have these situations that they feel like they're ruminating on. Like they're stuck on.
Karl:
Yeah. And there's opportunities and everything that you're stuck on. And I think that sometimes we get stuck because we're not fully aligned with what's in our heart and the get unstuck we've got to align with, you know, those deep feelings that sometimes aren't always there and accessible on the surface.
Michaela:
My, my astrologer said to me, uh, who I have I've had on this podcast, she's incredible. I have, she's like my therapist, I have her on, uh, you know, on redial. She's every three months in my life, we sit and talk about planetary what's happening. He had my solar system and uh, she said, you need to show up. Uh, I mean, she said amazing things about that. Um, you know, I'm over here and that all of these people are over here and I'm going to be shuttling people back and forth, back and forth with a boat. And only those that are willing to get in the boat are going to come and that's okay. I need the people who are ready. And then she says, and you can't show up with revenge for those who don't get in the boat. And, and I was like, wow. You know, I can't show up in an angry way. I just need to accept that they're there. And that's okay because I do have all of these other people who are ready to hop in the boat. And I love that. And it's kind of what you just described, you know, in the sense that like, it's all right, it's all right. To move forward with people who are in the space. I'm in where my natural kind of personality is like no one left behind Titanic, you know?
Karl:
Exactly. And it's tough because we want people to really grow and, and see things in a, and this is what's, it's, it's not fair, but we always think our way is usually the better way. And that's what they're thinking too. Right. And it's like, and, and sometimes just not meant to be, you know, it's not meant to, you're not meant to connect on that level.
Michaela:
Wow. This has been just a really eye opening episode. I I'm saying that for me. I get more from these podcasts. I think, um, I'm reading a book right now called fortitude by Dan Crenshaw. I don't know if you've read it. I haven't. Oh my gosh. Navy. Uh, no, not a Navy seal army ranger, I think, uh, had his eyes blown out by a bomb and, Oh my gosh, it is Epic. It is so good. And I'm actually working. I've been working on a book for quite some time. I just finished petting a fiction, psychological thriller fiction novel, which is really fun. Um, but I've been working on a book that is about the idea of letting go of, of giving up things that aren't serving you anymore. And so I'm about 15,000 words into it and I'm feeling more inspired now than ever to, uh, to continue writing it after reading fortitude. That's all good. So good. Yeah. And that's what I was saying. You know, being a reader makes me a good writer and that's important to me. Um, and then I need to find ways to make more time to keep doing those things that I love.
Karl:
Yeah, me too. It's telling me finding those little pockets of 20 minutes here, 20 minutes there, like, you know, we have busy lives and there's so much going on and, you know, with COVID and, uh, friends and kids and family, like, ah, it's, you know, you gotta find those times for, to do those things that matter to you.
Michaela:
Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. So do you, do you have a book? Do you coach what what's, uh, what's your stick there? How, how are you, how are you helping people with the dicta fly method? Yes.
Karl:
Most of what I do is through community IRA, a few select, uh, coaching clients that I work with. Um, but Mo for the most part is just building out, um, this framework, I have a book called brain gratitude. Um, and that's, you know, it's, it's funny how each book I've written. Um, it's my second book. I'm working on my third book called sleep disorder. Cause I think we don't utilize, you know, kind of like the fly is a great way to kind of calm yourself and, and look for opportunities. But how are you, uh, using things at the, um, you know, thoughts and emotions at the end of the day, because what you think about, uh, three things you think about and the most impactful thing you think about at the end of the day, go into your longterm memory. And so if you're thinking about, you know, like your friend, like, I can't believe he said this, I can't believe he said that.
Karl:
Then, then you go to bed with those, you know, those thoughts and those emotions and they solidify in your neurons, um, and your neural network. And then you wake up feeling this way. You wake up with like negative energy, but if you go to bed thinking, Oh, okay, like, you know, he's not in the proper space right now, but I had a really great conversation with Amy today or Tom or whoever, and like, Oh, it was, this really opened up my eyes. Now you're thinking of like positive things that happened to you and the things that went well. And now you're drawn to do more of those things the next. And that's the, one of the keys to growth is like doing these, uh, having an evening routine at the end of the night, that really allows you to kind of solidify these things into your longterm memory.
Karl:
And when they're, when they're, when you create this little weak neural network and you do it the next day and the next day after that, that's when you can really start to see a shift in your mindset and willingness to, you know, tackle those hard projects and do those things that will really move the needle. And so, you know, that's, it's, it's just amazing how each book builds on the next and how it changes you, you know, you're 15,000 words in, and it's like, I think journaling too. Like if you journal at the end of the night, you know, just what's going on in your life, you start to become more aware and you see these things, uh, and instead of just kinda brushing them off, um, and then it really starts to open you up and then your, you can make more aware and conscious decisions like, Hey, I'm going to talk to Amy more versus talking to somebody that, you know, we, we don't really see eye to eye in a lot of things.
Michaela:
I'm just sitting here thinking how I always tell my husband, I cannot watch this forensic files right before bed. Like I cannot do that. We need a lighthearted comedy. And now I know why it's because I don't want to steal the deal on death. Yeah.
Karl:
Yes, that's exactly it, because then you're
Michaela:
Those types of shows. Like even the walking dead, I love the walking dead, but man, if, if that was the last thing I watched before bed, I swear I woke up prepping for an apocalypse. Yes.
Karl:
Yes. And it's terrible. We wake up and worry. Okay.
Michaela:
She wasn't stressed. Yes, exactly. That's absolutely true. And then sometimes what's really creepy. I don't know if any listeners have ever had this. I continue the episode in my dream. Yeah. I continue dreaming about the same thing that we were watching only I'm in it, then it's really freaky. Yeah. So, um,
Karl:
Being dead is one you don't want to be in a drink. Yeah.
Michaela:
Yeah. But I, um, yeah, in writing this, in writing this book, I actually had to put the book that I'm writing called give up already on hold because I wrote a power to motivational journal for women. And so, um, and I just had 2000 words to put final touches on that psychological thriller. And I was dreading it because it was the final scene where everything kind of unfolded. And I was feeling like just a lot of weight and pressure about being in that space while everything in the world is happening now, because I started writing that psychological thriller a long time ago, but then I had a publisher interested in it, so I really needed to finish it. And it was just like, gosh, I don't know if I want to go into that mind again, it was fun when the world was great and it was like entertaining for me.
Michaela:
But now that the world kind of feels like that. I didn't want to be there in my head. It's, it's an interesting thing. Like, um, I guess writers can appreciate that getting into the, into the character, into the, into the feel of whatever it is that you're writing. Yeah. I glad I finished it. I finished it and has been sent to the publisher. It's actually been sent to the line content and manuscript editor, but, um, then it'll go to publishing and I don't have to think about that anymore. And I can really go back to kind of focusing on this self help book that I've been really excited about for a long time. That's been put on hold for so long. So it'll be good. It's good stuff.
Karl:
Good. Good. Yeah.
Michaela:
Well, it's been great. Uh, great having you on today and I will get all this stuff put into the show notes as well, um, for your website and how people can get in touch with you, but great stuff. I mean, really, I love the fact that you're kind of, you know, taking it to that space of rawness, um, getting to the root emotion of the heart of everything. And I love that. That's exactly what this series, the boat Y series is about. It's about that. It's about those kinds of conversations.
Karl:
That's cool. I'm so glad you liked it. It's great to get that feedback because when you work with clients and they pay you to do it versus somebody that's like, okay, what is this? You know, like more skeptical, you know? Yes, yes. Is that feedback? Thank you.
Michaela:
It's fabulous. Well, um, gosh, I'm just, this has just been so great. I don't even know how to end the show that never happens. Um, but we, you know, we'll get some feedback and, and, uh, I'd love to have you back on, you know, in the future and, and talk more about the sleep to soar method too. Cause that's just really interesting, good stuff.
Karl:
Yeah. Yeah. We'd love to come back and thanks everybody. Uh, really enjoy talking with you and, and, um, you did a great interview. It's been a lot of fun. Thanks Carl. Take care. Alright, you too. Bye.